Runway Threshold View Lost at Normal Approach Speed

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sfetbrandt
Posts: 27
Joined: Fri May 17, 2019 2:16 pm
Runway Threshold View Lost at Normal Approach Speed

Post by sfetbrandt » Thu Oct 03, 2019 6:08 pm

Hello.... I've been flying the F-4E for several months and absolutely love it! However, I've got a weird problem.... I cannot get a consistent, useful view of runway thresholds at recommended final-approach speed of 140 knots and 17 units AOA. I lose my sight picture because the top of the instrument panel blocks the ground view as the aircraft descends on final with the nose elevated. Lowering the nose increases the airspeed too much, making for "hot" landings. I've tried countless view configurations with ChasePlane, but no matter what view I use-- instrument panel and heads-up display tilted, close, far, up, down -- I just can't get a view that gives me a decent picture while on short final and on glideslope. I frequently end up landing short because I'm "guessing" when I'm going to cross the runway threshold. I was hoping someone here has an image from a proper landing attitude/cockpit view under recommended landing configuration they could share with me or perhaps offer a (non-snarky) suggestion how I can see where the heck I'm landing. Thanks.... Steve.

JonathanBleeker
Posts: 3446
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:38 pm
Re: Runway Threshold View Lost at Normal Approach Speed

Post by JonathanBleeker » Thu Oct 03, 2019 7:03 pm

Erm....140kts at 17 units AoA? I wouldn't dare go below 160 unless I was running on fumes with no payload. Don't bother trying to fly for a specific speed. Use a combo of AoA and descent rate instead and ignore your airspeed indicator.

sfetbrandt
Posts: 27
Joined: Fri May 17, 2019 2:16 pm
Re: Runway Threshold View Lost at Normal Approach Speed

Post by sfetbrandt » Thu Oct 03, 2019 7:43 pm

OK. Thanks! 'll give it a try. But I recall a cross-country actual flight I made during my primary flight training in which I got permission to cross Edwards AFB's airspace in California in the early 1970s. I was toodling along at about 100 knots in a Cessna 152 en route to Barstow-Daggett (I should have brought along a copy of War and Peace) when a couple of F-4's unexpectedly pulled up along either side of me not more than three or four wing-lengths away. They both had everything hanging. Apparently they were practicing bogey interception. Either that, or they just thought it would be funny to scare the hell out of me! Anyway, they literally hung by a thread in level flight, practically standing on their tail, for nearly a full minute before they both peeled off and disappeared....
Last edited by sfetbrandt on Thu Oct 03, 2019 7:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

sfetbrandt
Posts: 27
Joined: Fri May 17, 2019 2:16 pm
Re: Runway Threshold View Lost at Normal Approach Speed

Post by sfetbrandt » Thu Oct 03, 2019 7:43 pm

OK. I'll give it a try. But I recall a cross-country actual flight I made during my primary flight training in which I got permission to cross Edwards AFB's airspace in California in the early 1970s. I was toodling along at about 100 knots in a Cessna 152 en route to Barstow-Daggett (I should have brought along a copy of War and Peace) when a couple of F-4's unexpectedly pulled up along either side of me not more than three or four wing-lengths away. They both had everything hanging. Apparently they were practicing bogey interception. Either that, or they just thought it would be funny to scare the hell out of me! Anyway, they literally hung by a thread in level flight, practically standing on their tail, for nearly a full minute before they both peeled off and disappeared....

JonathanBleeker
Posts: 3446
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:38 pm
Re: Runway Threshold View Lost at Normal Approach Speed

Post by JonathanBleeker » Thu Oct 03, 2019 8:42 pm

Yeah it’s not going to fall out of the sky at 100kts. But they were definitely well beyond landing AoA and would likely have smashed the tail off if they had tried to land at that speed.

Raptor
Posts: 411
Joined: Wed Feb 26, 2014 3:07 am
Re: Runway Threshold View Lost at Normal Approach Speed

Post by Raptor » Fri Oct 04, 2019 2:04 pm

lol, I bet that was quite a sight! C152 leading 2 F-4s.

When I was doing my PPL, I was flying near Texas Motor Speedway on event Sunday. Of course, the speedway was TFR and I was like 5 miles outside the TFR in comms with ATC. They had F-16s in place shooting approaches to Alliance Airport (KAFW) when I hear ATC advising traffic at 12 o'clock (traffic was me) and the guy replies "Target in sight"... I'm like "I hope you dont mean you have me locked!"


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