Question about the fde

[Kalin]

Hi!
First of all thank you MILVIZ for the great plane!
I stumble across this review today https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbQBogMgLUA
I found it quite honest and maybe harsh in the beginning, but it rises a question which bothers me also. Is the plane a little bit to tail heavy on landing and take off ? We know about FSX limitations! So far I couldn`t make a proper front wheel landing, but no problem with the three point. In the Texan (you know which one) I have the opposite experience - perfect wheel landings and problematic three point. Also the the tail raises faster on take off. I know that T-6 is a different plane, but it`s the best tail dragger that we have in FSX. What is your opinion and experience?

[MatzeH84]

Same observations here..

[Kalin]

So, we have a problem
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu7QDAQG8LY

Another issue, this time with the float... I found this article:https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... er-359122/
Following quote: `` At about 35-45kt, I relaxed yoke back-pressure as the floats transitioned to the step, and the Beaver settled into a very slight nose-high attitude. At about 52kt the Beaver flew off the water.``
So 52kt is about 60mph... And Milviz Beaver in all of my tests flew of the water at about 80mph. This is quite a difference. Please, correct me if I am not right.

[Krazycolin]

These aren't straight floats. The wheel bays add a significant amount of drag...

[Kalin]

Thanks! Absolutly happy with the answer!

[Fliger747]

Hi

I am Tom Falley and I did the FDE for this aircraft. Somewhere in my long flying career of some 23500 hours I spent three seasons flying the Beavers up on the glaciers of Denali and have done my best to recreate the experience of flying this classic aircraft in the Sim environment. My experience with the Beaver is that it is a tail heavy aircraft, the tail does not come up until well into the takeoff run, especially with a load. Having made a couple of thousand Beaver take offs it feels about right to me. This is in contrast to some aircraft where the tail can be raised with the aircraft static, such as my own Supercub.

Floats, I am a very experienced float pilot as well though my experience in the Beaver on floats is quite limited. Remember that there is a significant conversion factor between Knots and MPH. Approximatly the speed required to takeoff a float plane varies with the weight in a more than linear fashion. Additional float displacement increases drag and also the speed required for takeoff. Floats do not allow much of an AOA to be developed directly without dragging the tails, which if the plane is loaded will probably prevent the takeoff. The technique I use, which is commonly used with float planes here in Alaska is to roll up on one float then lift the other one out.

[MatzeH84]

Did another 2 (longer) flights today, and must say that I have to revise my statement. With the rear tank empty and no or only a slight load in the back, I am totally able to get up on the wheels on takeoff or land it on the mains.
Only thing that really bothers me on ground is the tailwheel not free castoring beyong 25°, anything else seems just about right, great job!

[Kalin]

Thank you, gentlemen! I can sleep peacefully tonight

[Fliger747]

Unfortunately in flight sim the choice is between steerable and free castoring, the real tailwheel breaks free past the steering limit, this is not currently a choice in the sim. Because of this a free castoring simulation is often more realistic. The otter uses a steering motor but the Beaver uses the more traditional Spring/bungee type system which is a much less positive steering effect than the sim uses. One of the fun things to do Ina real or sim taildragger is to swing around one wheel into the parking space. It's the WWII fighters this usually possible in the sim as they had lockable and castoring but not steerable tailwheels.

As to the rear fuel tank, we seldom put much fuel in there for CG reasons.

[MatzeH84]

Well.. it IS possible, as some other products show. Of course this depends on the money and effort you are willing to put into it.
Personally I'd prefer the free castoring over the steerable, just to be able to turn on the spot.

[Krazycolin]

What exactly are you asking for here?

[MatzeH84]

Addo I suggested in the thread I posted, best would be to have the tailwheel steerable within 25 degrees and free castoring above 25 degrees. Best solution (fit the customers at least )!
Otherwise, personally, I would prefer trading the steerable tailwheel for a free castoring, as the tight-turn capability is not quite optimal the way it is now. Needing a whole midsized runway width to make a 180 is not what one would expect from a taildragger bush plane, that should be capable of operating on much smaller strips.

[StearmanDriver]

I've never flown a Beaver, but my thousands of hours flying and teaching in most other taildraggers out there do make me feel that the Milviz Beaver is a bit tail heavy. Look at this takeoff:

https://youtu.be/KHVfZx_MCoc

That's nothing I can come close to replicating in the Milviz, even light, with the CG as far forward as I can get it, and full forward yoke (if you watch the elevator in that video, it doesn't appear to take much forward yoke to get the tail up). Wheel landings compare similarly.

Taxiing, I get the castoring issue. And she flies great, I'm not one to let small nit picks ruin my enjoyment of an otherwise great plane. Just trying to point out what I see...

[Kdub]

I loaded the wheeled version for the first time last night. On my takeoff I was surprised when the tail came up without any forward yoke pressure. I then pushed forward and the tail rose more. A little back pressure and off she went. This was with full fuel and a passenger in the back! How can this be?

Kdub

[StearmanDriver]

I loaded the wheeled version for the first time last night. On my takeoff I was surprised when the tail came up without any forward yoke pressure. I then pushed forward and the tail rose more. A little back pressure and off she went. This was with full fuel and a passenger in the back! How can this be?

Kdub

I know I for one would like to know this. Mine behaves just like you can see in the video review posted at the beginning of this thread - tail comes up by itself but not till around 60mph, and forward yoke has no effect on changing this. If others are seeing different performance I'd love to know how!