Axis configuration

alehead
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:20 pm
Axis configuration

Post by alehead » Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:06 pm

Dear Milviz Support Team,

I am trying to understand how to configure my setup in order to use this addon. I have patiently waited years for this moment and I am currently a little disappointed to be honest.

I think the idea of an axis configuration tool is wonderful in general, similar to that of a well´-known and well-loved Dash8-Q400 addon out there.

I have a TQ6+ from VirtualFly with Hall Effect sensors on all axes.
I have used FSUIPC for years, and with the new profile abilities have never had any trouble configuring axes and settings. I understand that getting the PT6 engine to work properly in P3D requires some prowess, my hats off to you for attempting this.

Now, to business. I have assigned the 6 levers of the TQ6+ to AXIS THROTTLE 1 SET to AXIS MIXTURE 2 SET all the way through, X, Y, Z, Rx, Ry, Rz.
Now comes the part I do not understand at all. I have so many issues, I do not know where to start. Can somebody walk us through this, step by step?
I cannot match the power levers to each other, as the figures for similar hardware positions do not match in the numbers (something I will not be able to change). I would have thought there are hard-coded positions for max, idle beta and full reverse, that I simply set my number to. But that does not seem to work.
The propeller pitch setting doesn't use the full travel of the hardware lever.
The mixture levers sort of work correctly at the moment, though shut off is immediately after going through the low idle gate.

I have noticed that, at low idle condition and power levers set to idle, the aircraft will not creep but roll forward. I know this should happen at high idle, but not at low idle. The KA family has notoriously expensive brakes, so you would not want to be riding them all the time.

Is there going to be a much more clear version of the manual that explains how to set up the axes? would dearly hope so...

Andrew

JonathanBleeker
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Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:38 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by JonathanBleeker » Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:09 pm

Ok I'm a little confused as to whether or not you have tried our MVAMS axis calibration tool (the MJC Q400 was indeed the inspiration behind it).

When you click buttons to set the various detents, don't bother looking at the slider and markers. They are only there for visual confirmation that the detent is set. Look at your physical levers, and position them where you want them. The code will handle the rest.

Taguilo
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Re: Axis configuration

Post by Taguilo » Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:14 pm

alehead wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:06 pm

I have noticed that, at low idle condition and power levers set to idle, the aircraft will not creep but roll forward. I know this should happen at high idle, but not at low idle. The KA family has notoriously expensive brakes, so you would not want to be riding them all the time.

The KA will start rolling slowly even with CL and PL in low idle if parking brakes are not set (or brakes pressed).

Tomas

alehead
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:20 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by alehead » Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:03 pm

JonathanBleeker wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:09 pm
Ok I'm a little confused as to whether or not you have tried our MVAMS axis calibration tool (the MJC Q400 was indeed the inspiration behind it).

When you click buttons to set the various detents, don't bother looking at the slider and markers. They are only there for visual confirmation that the detent is set. Look at your physical levers, and position them where you want them. The code will handle the rest.
I have been trying to set it for hours... I spent two hours on it last night, and another two this early evening.

Only when I click on save as default do the values get written to axis.cfg. If I click on save alone, I see no change to the file (update of save timestamp). I also notice that values for Power,Prop, and Condition levers (not #1 and #2 and so on) also then get set, so that axis.cfg is really confusing. Why are those additional settings being made, even though I am not actually assigning a set of values to any axis for those?

If I set the values according to the lever positions of my hardware, the cockpit levers are not matching. That is, when I have the levers set for idle at the idle position I have set, the left power lever is at a different position from the right lever. For them to match in sim, I have to hold the power levers at an angle to each other with the hardware... does that make sense?

Thanks by the way for the information on the creep under low idle CLs at idle. I knew that high idle caused that. I stand corrected :)

Andrew

ccmh15
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Re: Axis configuration

Post by ccmh15 » Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:23 pm

Just to cheer you up, I've got the VirtualFly TQ6+ as well, and it's working perfectly fine.

I wrote down the raw analogue values from FSUIPC for each lever's positions, and manually put them into the axis.cfg. After this, I set the file to read-only, just in case.

I had some issues in the beginning as well, e.g. the right engine was sometimes entering the reverse zone a bit when the levers were physically at the idle detend, which made the aircraft veer sharp right - especially annoying during the flare.

With manually editing the axis.cfg, it was possible to really fine tune everything perfectly.

The fact that you already know about this file and what it does obviously means you can't be far from the perfect setup!

Chris

alehead
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:20 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by alehead » Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:31 pm

ccmh15 wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:23 pm
Just to cheer you up, I've got the VirtualFly TQ6+ as well, and it's working perfectly fine.

I wrote down the raw analogue values from FSUIPC for each lever's positions, and manually put them into the axis.cfg. After this, I set the file to read-only, just in case.

I had some issues in the beginning as well, e.g. the right engine was sometimes entering the reverse zone a bit when the levers were physically at the idle detend, which made the aircraft veer sharp right - especially annoying during the flare.

With manually editing the axis.cfg, it was possible to really fine tune everything perfectly.

The fact that you already know about this file and what it does obviously means you can't be far from the perfect setup!

Chris

Cheers Chris for the comments! You could do me a real favour and send me your axis.cfg file? I know your TQ6+ values won't match mine, but it will help with the basic layout. I also do not understand why the values for [THROTTLE], [PROP], and [CONDITION] are being written when I do not configure them, all I want is [THROTTLE1], [THROTTLE2] and so on.

Thanks in advance!

Andrew

ccmh15
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Re: Axis configuration

Post by ccmh15 » Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:46 pm

alehead wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:31 pm
You could do me a real favour and send me your axis.cfg file?
Of course, will do so on Friday! (I'm currently away)
Regards
Chris

alehead
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:20 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by alehead » Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:50 pm

Thanks! That would be really kind. In the meantime, I will play with the figures I have and your golden hint :)

A

alehead
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:20 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by alehead » Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:58 pm

In the meantime, I have been playing with manually set figures that I took directly from FSUIPC, as Chris suggested.

Currently, I am probably more confused than before.

I am trying to set the power levers. I have them assigned as THROTTLE1 and THROTTLE2. Now, setting the exact values in FSUIPC returned for the positions I wish each detent to be, I have the extremes at 16383 and -16384. The idle and beta positions on each lever do not match up exactly though (perhaps a Hall sensor thing?). So I use a set value for a hardware lever position and enter it. The figures I have place the levers in the cockpit at 51 and 47 (the tool tip settings values). So, I start changing the values in axis.cfg to try and match them up at the beta position, around 50 for each lever.

Now here is the odd thing: Altering the value for ONLY ONE lever causes both to move to a lower position (as determined by the tooltip value)! How can changing one setting affect both levers?

Confused? You bet I am!

Andrew

PS: The condition levers behave perfectly well, moving swiftly from the cut off to low idle detent, and then on to the high idle position. The prop lever misbehaves however. Feather is not at the lever value it should be at...
Maybe Chris understands, having seen this on his setup?

JonathanBleeker
Posts: 3446
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:38 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by JonathanBleeker » Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:27 am

alehead wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:03 pm
Only when I click on save as default do the values get written to axis.cfg. If I click on save alone, I see no change to the file (update of save timestamp). I also notice that values for Power,Prop, and Condition levers (not #1 and #2 and so on) also then get set, so that axis.cfg is really confusing. Why are those additional settings being made, even though I am not actually assigning a set of values to any axis for those?
Yes the save as default is what actually performs the file write. The code writes everything, because you are supposed to configure everything you have levers for.
alehead wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:03 pm
If I set the values according to the lever positions of my hardware, the cockpit levers are not matching. That is, when I have the levers set for idle at the idle position I have set, the left power lever is at a different position from the right lever. For them to match in sim, I have to hold the power levers at an angle to each other with the hardware... does that make sense?
Something is not making sense here. If the physical levers match eachother at idle then they should also match in sim. @Taguilo please make sure the animation is taking the same data as the actual engine setting.

alehead
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:20 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by alehead » Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:01 pm

alehead wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:03 pm
Only when I click on save as default do the values get written to axis.cfg. If I click on save alone, I see no change to the file (update of save timestamp). I also notice that values for Power,Prop, and Condition levers (not #1 and #2 and so on) also then get set, so that axis.cfg is really confusing. Why are those additional settings being made, even though I am not actually assigning a set of values to any axis for those?
JonathanBleeker wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:27 am
Yes the save as default is what actually performs the file write. The code writes everything, because you are supposed to configure everything you have levers for.
But I only use the THROTTLE1, THROTTLE2 and so on that assign an individual hardware axis to one in-sim lever and not the THROTTLE/PROP/CONDITION settings that pair up each set of levers onto one axis. Is that possibly having any effect on the hardware?
alehead wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:03 pm
If I set the values according to the lever positions of my hardware, the cockpit levers are not matching. That is, when I have the levers set for idle at the idle position I have set, the left power lever is at a different position from the right lever. For them to match in sim, I have to hold the power levers at an angle to each other with the hardware... does that make sense?
JonathanBleeker wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:27 am
Something is not making sense here. If the physical levers match eachother at idle then they should also match in sim. @Taguilo please make sure the animation is taking the same data as the actual engine setting.
I set my hardware levers on the TQ6+ to the hard detent marked reverse (it is a stop), so both levers are parallel. At this point I had set the beta marker, but the two levers in-sim were returning different values, not much apart, but definitely noticeable...

Thanks for looking into this. I am interested to see Chris' TQ6+ axis.cfg file. It might help...

A

JonathanBleeker
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Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:38 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by JonathanBleeker » Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:05 pm

The extra single lever settings won't have any effect if FSUIPC doesn't transmit data through those events.

alehead
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:20 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by alehead » Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:15 pm

JonathanBleeker wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:05 pm
The extra single lever settings won't have any effect if FSUIPC doesn't transmit data through those events.
Seems logical, cheers...

I will play around with the hardware and axis.cfg file later... I have to teach online now :)

A

ccmh15
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Re: Axis configuration

Post by ccmh15 » Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:18 pm

Check all other USB Game Controllers (if any), maybe there is one interfering with P3D's default axis mapping.
Also, check the "Delta" value within FSUIPC, default is 256 - the result is, that the levers within the virtual cockpit only move in "1% steps", but the TQ6+ can work way more precise.

More as soon as I'm back at my sim (tomorrow morning)!

alehead
Posts: 72
Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:20 pm
Re: Axis configuration

Post by alehead » Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:37 pm

ccmh15 wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:18 pm
Check all other USB Game Controllers (if any), maybe there is one interfering with P3D's default axis mapping.
Also, check the "Delta" value within FSUIPC, default is 256 - the result is, that the levers within the virtual cockpit only move in "1% steps", but the TQ6+ can work way more precise.

More as soon as I'm back at my sim (tomorrow morning)!
Good points there Chris. I have removed all references to the controllers I have. There are no other axes programmed for the throttles/props/condition levers in the MilViz KA350i. It is just the TQ6+
The delta value I usually set down to 1, as nearly all my devices are Hall effect sensors, though I manually set it to 8 in the fsuipc profile for the KA350i.

Speak to you later :)

Andrew


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