Elite King Air USB Throttle Quadrant - not working!

[ccmh15]

Hi Guys,

I just spend a sh**load of money on one of those: https://www.flyelite.ch/en/shop/king-ai ... -quadrant/

tl;dr: Is it possible to get this throttle quadrant running with the MilViz King Air 350i?

Edit APR 2020: No, it's not.

Long story:
It's sold as a stand-alone USB Throttle Quadrant, specially designed for the King Air, with metal casing and detents for idle, feather and fuel cutoff, all within a sturdy metal casing.

Now, after unpacking, I'm a bit baffled - against my expectations, this thing does not show up as an USB Game Controller within Windows, instead, some crappy old proprietary driver software and "P3D Third Party Plugin" needs to be installed.

After loading P3D, this nice little message is shown:


I'm using P3D Version 4.5.13.32097, Academic Version.

Anyways, after dismissing this "useful" message (actually it closed itself after a few seconds), I loaded a default P3D airplane (the Mooney), and found a new entry in the P3D top menu bar within Add-Ons -> "ELITE Config..."

Looks like this:


After working through all the internal calibration stuff, the fears that I already had in the back of my head became reality: the levers are working in the stock P3D aircraft, but nothing moves in the King Air.....

As this device is not recognized by Windows as a USB Game Controller, I can't assign or calibrate anything in FSUIPC, nor can I see anything in the MVAMS tool.

Before I throw this (admittedly sturdy and well-built) metal brick back to Switzerland, does anyone have an idea on how I could get this to work?
Or better, is anyone using it already with the Milviz KA350? Can't be the only one here who googled "King Air Throttle Quadrant" in the last few weeks and spent some bucks on this piece of hardware!

Thanks so much in advance for any useful input.
Regards,
Chris

[N4GIX]

Odd that it uses a USB cable but isn't recognized as a USB device...
That is a lovely (and expensive) bit of hardware. Perhaps Elite could provide some advice on configuration?

[ccmh15]

Actually, it does show as an USB device within the Windows Device Manager - but not as a Game Controller or HID, but as a proprietary USB device:


The Windows USB Game Controller dialogue stays empty though:


Just tried to find my way through the Elite support portal, and ended up here:


This is going to be interesting!
I'll try to get in touch with someone there tomorrow...

[ccmh15]

A little follow-up:

Unfortunately, I had to return the Elite Thingy back to Switzerland.

As there is no way to operate the throttle as a normal USB Game Controller, that rather uses some proprietary plugin DLL that writes directly to the MSFS stock variables, it is simply not possible to use it for the King Air. It only works with Aircraft that use the default FSX/P3D throttle logic.

The customer support crew from Elite is undoubtedly friendly and supportive, but as it's also stated on the product's homepage - they do not guarantee their hardware to work with 3rd party add-in aircraft, and can't help here either.

Theoretically, I guess there might be a possibility to write a small external tool, that reads out the internal P3D variables and emulates a virtual USB HID device or something, but for an expensive piece of hardware like this, a creepy workaround is just not acceptable in my eyes. Also, I really didn't want to go that far to open it up and re-wire it with some Arduino Joystick emulator......

Instead, I invested a bit more and got myself the VirtualFly TQ6+ from Spain - and it's simply awesome.
(no, I'm not in any way affiliated )

Being much bigger and even more sturdy than the Elite King Air Throttle (which is actually also not too bad hardware-wise), it's the perfect throttle to really make precise power setting adjustments.



Yes yes I know, those piston colored levers don't exactly fit into a turboprop, but maybe one day I'll just repaint those (metal) handles black

So for me, the search for the ultimate throttle hardware is over!
br,
Chris

[Kdub]

I bought the Elite years ago on sale. They rarely go on sale, but it was the rare opportunity to get one at a great price. At the time a competitor's B200 had just arrived on the scene, and a kind person working with Elite wrote a plug-in to work with FSX and the B200. With the advent of P3D the Elite is now a dust collector. I would love to get the TQ6, but $$$$$$. The wife has actually okayed the purchase, but the expense!


Kdub

[Bushido]

It's a bit stupid to make very expensive hardware that can only work with stock P3D planes...
Given the price they sale their product Don't they think that their customer will likely have add ons aircraft ?
Weird (poor ?) strategy, for sure.

[ccmh15]

The hardware they make is primarily for their own simulation environment "ELITE Pilot", which has it's focus on professional flight training and certified procedure trainer for flight schools. So, in their defense, they never intended that FSX or P3D "gamers" would use their products.

But of course, it's a shame to sell a throttle quadrant that is P3D "compatible", but not even recognized by Windows as a basic USB Game Controller (as anyone would expect in 2020), just some proprietary hardware that needs some old sofware DLLs to run.

However, "we" are just not the customers they target, so they won't put too much effort in here.

[Bushido]

Thanks for the insight, make sense then.

[Kdub]

Tried to be happy with the plastic six-axis quadrant, but just not the ticket. Also worried because these plastic quadrants are notorious for wearing out and losing function. On top of that they are getting very difficult to replace, probably because production of parts is still limited in China. So I'm sending it back while I can still get a refund. What next?

Kdub

[Kdub]

A little follow-up:

Unfortunately, I had to return the Elite Thingy back to Switzerland.

As there is no way to operate the throttle as a normal USB Game Controller, that rather uses some proprietary plugin DLL that writes directly to the MSFS stock variables, it is simply not possible to use it for the King Air. It only works with Aircraft that use the default FSX/P3D throttle logic.

The customer support crew from Elite is undoubtedly friendly and supportive, but as it's also stated on the product's homepage - they do not guarantee their hardware to work with 3rd party add-in aircraft, and can't help here either.

Theoretically, I guess there might be a possibility to write a small external tool, that reads out the internal P3D variables and emulates a virtual USB HID device or something, but for an expensive piece of hardware like this, a creepy workaround is just not acceptable in my eyes. Also, I really didn't want to go that far to open it up and re-wire it with some Arduino Joystick emulator......

Instead, I invested a bit more and got myself the VirtualFly TQ6+ from Spain - and it's simply awesome.
(no, I'm not in any way affiliated )

Being much bigger and even more sturdy than the Elite King Air Throttle (which is actually also not too bad hardware-wise), it's the perfect throttle to really make precise power setting adjustments.



Yes yes I know, those piston colored levers don't exactly fit into a turboprop, but maybe one day I'll just repaint those (metal) handles black

So for me, the search for the ultimate throttle hardware is over!
br,
Chris

Okay...what else could I do? Makes flying the approach so precise. You get what you pay for.

Kdub

[alehead]

I have a bit of a history with VirtualFly when it comes to these quadrant devices.

I have nothing but praise for them. Their customer support is in a word excellent, at least in my experience.

I originally had one of the TQ6's, which had potentiometer issues twice over a period of a couple of years. They asked me to return it to the factory and the equipment was repaired with new potentiometers. When it was returned by them the second time, FedEx lost the package. After over a month of e-mailing and telephoning with FedEx, they finally traced the package and it was shipped to me. It was in quite a state when it arrived, dented and scratched, after having been opened at some point in transit, maybe to determine the package contents, but not being re-packed according to VirtualFly's instructions and methods (they come well-packaged in a sturdy box and plastic spacing/protection). So the TQ6 and its mounting bracket had been rattling around in its box freely for over two weeks probably.

I contacted VirtualFly. Their response without hesitation was to send me a new TQ6, but this time they sent me the Plus version, with Hall effect sensors...

When I asked if they wanted to have the original TQ6 returned, they declined my offer, telling me that I can keep it. It eventually found a new home in the UK... The equipment comes with a price, true. But the pleasure it has provided over the years I have been using the devices is priceless... if you can afford one, I believe you won't regret it.

Andrew

[Kdub]

True. VirtualFly is a first-class operation with first-class service. The TQ6+ works great with the 350i.


Kkdub

[Yoda]

Okay, I've done a search of the forum for a fix for the Elite TQ and haven't found anything. The controller setup tutorial has this note:

"IMPORTANT: Any hardware controller that doesn’t list as an option in Controller combo
won’t be available for use in the KA350i with P3D default configuration"

Is there a fix that will allow me to use my Elite TQ?

[ccmh15]

Unfortunately not... but it has to be said here once again, it's not MilViz' fault.

The Elite Hardware uses a very old proprietary controller that doesn't appear to the operating system as a USB Game Controller Device. Instead, if you want to use the Elite Hardware with FSX/P3D (which it basically isn't designed for!), you need to use an arguably ridiculous DLL, that directly accesses simulator variables, instead of just setting analogue axis values. And as the MVKA doesn't use default simulator values for its throttle/prop/condition levers, it can't work.

I figured out two possible solutions:

• Re-Wire the controller to use an Arduino that actually acts as a USB Game Controller (I've already done this with a few old PFC Yokes and Throttle Quadrants)
• Write a little software (maybe in C#), that reads the default simulator values for throttle/prop/mixture and feeds a virtual joystick with those values

My Elite was brand new when I got it, so rewiring wasn't an option, and I also didn't bother to write this software - therefore I sent it back.

If you are willing to open up your Elite Throttle Quadrant and do a little soldering to squeeze in a little Arduino, I could try to assist with technical advice and the necessary firmware.

Cheers!
Chris

[Yoda]

Thanks, Chris...that's too much work for the short period of time I expect to have my Elite TQ in service; the Honeycomb Bravo TQ is expected out this Fall and I expect to retire my 15 year-old Elite TQ at that point.