Multiple Issues

[Taguilo]

For the first of the day with a fresh battery, anything in excess of 20 AMPS even with a some of the high consumers on is wrong. I don't take issue with the generator load meter showing the large demand on that generator, it's a side effect of the real issue which is excessive draw. In that clip, the time from no power established to first start on the battery was maybe less than 2 minutes. In the real world, I routinely tie up the busses (which I did not do in that clip), power the flap motor, turn the avionics master on (to get ATIS), and even power some of our additional equipment in the cabin and have never seen such an excessive draw so quick. Just food for thought.

Well, this is the comment I used as a reference to model the battery draw at startup:

"...Then you turn on the gen, and the battery ammeter pegs up (charging) and the generator loadmeter pegs. The only current limit is internal to the GCU. If you are watching closely the GCU really doesn't make it all the way to 28.5 volts since it is limiting current to protect the current limiters. By the time the Loadmeter comes off the peg, you're at full system voltage."

Rt gen just on.PNG (27.59 KiB) Viewed 1670 times

This comes from Paul Sneden, a King Air maintenance specialist, well known in Beech forums.

I guess if I ask ten different KA pilots I will get ten different comments on how batt draw performs after start.
For now I decided to keep the current version as I am very respectful of the source.
However, I am thinking, for incoming SP, to add some random condition that will let draw come different depending if it is a first flight, etc. using the info provided by you.


Tomas

[KenG]

I have seen a lot of different electrical draws on the King Airs I have flown and a lot of different draw simulations in the various simulators.

None of the FFS I have flown exactly matched the electrical draw of any of the airplanes I flew.

The fact the needle moves in the correct direction at the correct time meets the training requirement.

When checking this product I used the same logic as opposed to try and represent a particular airplane. Thus some of the things you will see will represent how it is shown in an FFS.


Meanwhile, on to the airspeed issue, I noticed that as well during yesterday's flight and we want to get that fixed.

[N4GIX]

Noted. Will be fixed together with new lever control options in the next two days.

Low/High idle is working properly using the VC levers here Tomas, as well as keyboard and Saitek quad levers.

[Torkermax]

Though I have the saitek throttles working with FSUIPC, I still have no low idle even with the cfg -25 mod. Ive burned through 4 sets of brakes.

[N4GIX]

Though I have the saitek throttles working with FSUIPC, I still have no low idle even with the cfg -25 mod. Ive burned through 4 sets of brakes.

For whatever it's worth, I do not have a registered FSUIPC so my Saitek quad is working with the default P3D variables. I haven't even done anything with the P3D settings either for that matter...

[jacob.krustchinsky]

For the first of the day with a fresh battery, anything in excess of 20 AMPS even with a some of the high consumers on is wrong. I don't take issue with the generator load meter showing the large demand on that generator, it's a side effect of the real issue which is excessive draw. In that clip, the time from no power established to first start on the battery was maybe less than 2 minutes. In the real world, I routinely tie up the busses (which I did not do in that clip), power the flap motor, turn the avionics master on (to get ATIS), and even power some of our additional equipment in the cabin and have never seen such an excessive draw so quick. Just food for thought.

Well, this is the comment I used as a reference to model the battery draw at startup:

"...Then you turn on the gen, and the battery ammeter pegs up (charging) and the generator loadmeter pegs. The only current limit is internal to the GCU. If you are watching closely the GCU really doesn't make it all the way to 28.5 volts since it is limiting current to protect the current limiters. By the time the Loadmeter comes off the peg, you're at full system voltage."

Rt gen just on.PNG

This comes from Paul Sneden, a King Air maintenance specialist, well known in Beech forums.

I guess if I ask ten different KA pilots I will get ten different comments on how batt draw performs after start.
For now I decided to keep the current version as I am very respectful of the source.
However, I am thinking, for incoming SP, to add some random condition that will let draw come different depending if it is a first flight, etc. using the info provided by you.


Tomas

I think the intent of my comment was missed. The drain on the battery leading up to the start is wrong. The behavior you described above is correct, it is the fact that without the gen ties closed and no consumers online we are seeing a discharge in excess of 20+ amps. I started the aircraft on stream last night and noted a total time on the battery of ~1.5 minutes. In that time the battery took nearly 4 minutes to recover to the point where the operating generator load meter was showing 50% or less. I've made a note to video this in the real aircraft next week.

With the generator ties closed, and having any consumer online for more than a few minutes I would expect to see what is currently modeled in the aircraft. But for the first start of the day, with nothing tied up and no consumers online the draw is excessive.

[lequinne]

@jacob.krustchinsky @matpietsch

Any and all details on the PL21 issues will be very much appreciated and acted on promptly. If pictures of the map display from the real ac are provided, that would be even more appreciated, especially in regards to the direct-to functionality. Please feel free to message me directly.

Farley

[Turbofandude]

I'm a real world King Air pilot, lot of time split between 200s and 350ERs. First impressions are that most of the systems that I care about being modeled are present and a faithful representation. Deeper examination showed some major inconsistencies and abnormal behavior. The claim "Beyond study level" is a scary label to put on an aircraft that has some glaring issues.

1. Low Idle vs High Idle: There is no change in N1 when the condition levers are advanced from Low Idle to High Idle or retarded from High Idle to Low Idle. This is an obvious behavior that didn't make it into the addon for some reason.

2. HYD FLUID SENSOR test switch: When depressed the HYD FLUID LOW annunciator immediately appears. The real world behavior is approx. a 3-5 second delay between depressing the switch and receiving the annunciator light. This is due to the float being pulled to the bottom of the hydraulic fluid reservoir. The modeled behavior would indicate an incredibly low reservoir level.

3. Performance: The aircraft does not perform like a real King Air 350 at all. I would expect that with props at high and torque at approx. 40% to settle around 160KIAS (+- 10), this aircraft is consistently 40-50 KIAS faster. This is just one example of easily validated performance that cannot be replicated in the simulator. The aircraft's pitch reference is wrong. I would expect at least a 2.5 - 3.5 degree nose up attitude to fly level. The current behavior is more like 0-.05 degrees which is not accurate. There is so much more to discuss here, but I would recommend utilizing the tab data in the POH to at a minimum flight validate the modeled performance before we dig into the more important stuff.

4. Pro Line 21: Glaring issues on this front. I have yet to get the auto-tune LOC to work properly. On any ILS/LOC approach, after NAV swap the course has never been set properly. The AP under-arcs the GP every time, leaving my consistently low regardless of configuration. VNAV is INOP as far as I'm concerned. DEP/ARR page doesn't work the same as the real aircraft. Have yet to be able to successfully utilize a SEC FPLN or ALTN in regards to the DEP/ARR page. Highly strange behavior when going direct to a point on a published approach. Range will bounce around and if you decide to set a course when going direct, it will sometimes just delete your points. Alot more to talk about on this front, but I'm sure you're aware of some of it.

Conclusion: After just a couple of hours I've uncovered ALOT of items that any King Air pilot with a pulse would have provided feedback on. I'm open to being used as a resource to improve this addon, but I'm honestly baffled at the $80 price tag. The bar for "study-level" seems to be getting lower.

Please clarify any FMS or PL21 behavior issues. If you have real reference and/or specific examples, we would be happy to correct ours to match.

[jacob.krustchinsky]

@jacob.krustchinsky @matpietsch

Any and all details on the PL21 issues will be very much appreciated and acted on promptly. If pictures of the map display from the real ac are provided, that would be even more appreciated, especially in regards to the direct-to functionality. Please feel free to message me directly.

Farley

I'll be flying the aircraft again today on stream. I'll make a note of what I find on a standard point to point flight and send a list your way.

[Torkermax]

Though I have the saitek throttles working with FSUIPC, I still have no low idle even with the cfg -25 mod. Ive burned through 4 sets of brakes.

For whatever it's worth, I do not have a registered FSUIPC so my Saitek quad is working with the default P3D variables. I haven't even done anything with the P3D settings either for that matter...

I have and only will use FSUIPC for axis assignments and believe for many it would be greatly advantageous for the throttles to be able to be set up using FSUIPC. For numerous reasons. If there is some doubt on how you can do this, I may suggest contacting Pete Dowson, if your courageous enough. I wouldn't suggest suggesting there is a problem with his FSUIPC.

[JonathanBleeker]

Though I have the saitek throttles working with FSUIPC, I still have no low idle even with the cfg -25 mod. Ive burned through 4 sets of brakes.

For whatever it's worth, I do not have a registered FSUIPC so my Saitek quad is working with the default P3D variables. I haven't even done anything with the P3D settings either for that matter...

I have and only will use FSUIPC for axis assignments and believe for many it would be greatly advantageous for the throttles to be able to be set up using FSUIPC. For numerous reasons. If there is some doubt on how you can do this, I may suggest contacting Pete Dowson, if your courageous enough. I wouldn't suggest suggesting there is a problem with his FSUIPC.

I am working on providing a setup similar to MJC's Q400 which you will be able to use with FSUIPC, just not with calibration. Instead you will define the various zones in the MVAMS.